Re: [Discuss-sudbury-model] RE: a newcomer wanting to learn

From: Mimsy Sadofsky <mimsys_at_attbi.com>
Date: Sun Jan 19 19:11:00 2003

Uh, oh. I forgot to warn my kids not to make fun of jazz musicians.
Not even lightly but repeatedly over a long period of time.

I guess we can't cover all the bases at home. Thank heavens Sudbury
schools cover so many in the constant talk, talk and more talk about
every issue imaginable.

Mimsy

On Sat, an 2003 23:26:38 -0500, you wrote:

>Jennifer wrote:
>
>***************
>"With regard to the drugs, racism, swearing etc - these are in our
>society. It is better to educate children about these things so they
>have an understanding of them rather than prohibiting them."
>
>But how do you educate them so they have an understanding? or is it
>trusted that those conversations will happen at home... what if kids are
>not interested in engaging in conversations about these subjects. I
>would love to hear how these subjects are approached with kids in
>schools.
>****************
>
>Our kids learn about these issues both at home and at school. Of course
>we have always told them about the danger inherent with alcohol and
>drugs, so by the time they went to school they were aware of what they
>can do.
>
>As far as sex is concerned, we have always answered the questions and
>given them complete info and explanation insofar as their interest goes.
>I am sure they hear all about every detail of sex at school. They not
>quite at the age where they are interested in it, so right now it just
>sort of goes in one ear and out the other. Regardless, between the
>school and us (their parents) we will always make sure they have the
>best information we can give.
>
>They know that open sexuality and alcohol/drugs have a social
>ramification because there is a variety of legislation prohibiting
>substances at the school, as well as rules that define what a phohibited
>sexual activity is at the school. So there is an innate learning
>process there.
>
>Racism - this isn't really a stand-alone subject, it goes along with all
>of the issues of making fun of people in ways that the people don't want
>to be made fun of. The primary piece of this behavioral puzzle is
>learned far before school age, wherein parents teach children not to
>make fun of the handicapped, the elderly, and jazz musicians. The
>lesson is most effectively learned wherein the child learns to have
>empathy for fellow beings, but this hinges on how empathetic people the
>parents are (and how consistent they are and how well they communicate
>with their children).
>
>If students show up at the school and haven't learned this at home, they
>either learn quickly or else they end up expelled. It's often sad, but
>the school can't afford to baby along people who can't quickly learn how
>to push all of the sensitive buttons. JC and School Meeting have a
>ridiculously short tolerance level for unwanted fun-making. In fact my
>son just got sentenced for telling someone that they are a piece of
>plastic last week. No kidding.
>
>And finally, swearing. I don't know why this is grouped with all these
>other subjects. Every adult I know swears in certain situations. All I
>can say about Fairhaven students is that they learn how to swear well,
>and they learn what is the right situation to do it in. In fact, and I
>have said this here in the past, I know fully well that my son (10) is a
>fully capable and fairly talented swearer. And yet he never swears in
>my presence. I don't know why as I have never told him not to, but the
>point is that he has a superior filter system and that's all he really
>needs to know about swearing in this world.
>
>Finally, caffiene, junk food, drugs and TV all in one sentence, with
>only commas separating them? Some of those things are usually found
>well within an individual's right to choose in most schools, or in
>pretty much any level of society. If someone sees caffeine and TV as
>being on the level with drugs (and feels the same way about drugs that I
>do), I would advise him or her to stay away from Sudbury schools.
>Caffeine is not considered an illegal drug at our school, and many of us
>think TV is pretty beneficial.
>
>Hope this sheds some light.
>
>Joe Jackson
>Fairhaven School
>Upper Marlboro, Maryland
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: discuss-sudbury-model-admin_at_sudval.org
>[mailto:discuss-sudbury-model-admin_at_sudval.org] On Behalf Of Jennifer
>Blair
>Sent: Saturday, January 18, 2003 8:54 PM
>To: discuss-sudbury-model_at_sudval.org
>Subject: Re: [Discuss-sudbury-model] sex & drugs & power & control
>
>
>"With regard to the drugs, racism, swearing etc - these are in our
>society. It is better to educate children about these things so they
>have an understanding of them rather than prohibiting them."
>
>But how do you educate them so they have an understanding? or is it
>trusted that those conversations will happen at home... what if kids are
>not interested in engaging in conversations about these subjects. I
>would love to hear how these subjects are approached with kids in
>schools.
>----- Original Message -----
>From: dwyn_at_kiwilink.co.nz
>Sent: Saturday, January 18, 2003 3:39 PM
>To: discuss-sudbury-model_at_sudval.org
>Subject: [Discuss-sudbury-model] sex & drugs & power & control
>
>>
>> The tree forts and video games, as well as, perhaps, the junk food,
>issues all, in part, fall into the
>> "waiting for the other shoe to drop" syndrome. After years of
>traditional upbringing and/or
>> schooling, even though we tell the kids that they have complete
>freedom to choose their own
>> activities, they don't completely believe us. They usually go through
>what can be an extended
>> period of testing the limits of this freedom.
>
>
>Additionally, as parents, we are in a position of power over our
>children, and for the child, growing up is a process of wresting that
>power off us and learning to be an independent person. In western
>society we are taught that power over others is justified if you can
>make an argument for the other person being "incapable of looking after
>themselves". I don't believe this is true.
>The biggest challenge as parents is to give up that power to your child
>and find other ways to support them and protect them from danger without
>impinging on their right to self determination (which even the youngest
>child has).
>With regard to the drugs, racism, swearing etc - these are in our
>society. It is better to educate children about these things so they
>have an understanding of them rather than prohibiting them. Prohibition
>of anything has never worked in any country. Drug use in particular is
>common and as parents we will not be able to stop our kids experimenting
>if they want to. We can arm them with good information to stop them
>OD'ing or getting into trouble with the police.
>Drug propaganda (especially in America) is way over the top and kids
>know that instinctivly. The belief that their parents trust them will go
>further to control a teenagers drug use than trying to hide the issue or
>prohibit use or any other form of control.
>As my mother used to say about curfews, sex and drugs - "anything you
>can do after dark you can do before dark. I just have to trust you or
>else Im admitting that I wasn't a good parent."
>
>
>Sandra Murray
>************************************************************************
>*******************
> A Threat to Justice Anywhere;
> Is a Threat to Justice
>Everywhere
>
>
>Sandra Murray Cannabis Outreach Co-ordinator
>
>dwyn_at_kiwilink.co.nz ph 09 368 1355
>c/o Green Party
> Mob 021 890 629
>PO Box 1553, Auckland
>************************************************************************
>********************
>
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Received on Sun Jan 19 2003 - 19:10:35 EST

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