Re: re[2]: DSM: democratic classroom

From: william van horn (wmvh1@excite.com)
Date: Sun Nov 25 2001 - 15:58:31 EST


David, I'm sorry, but is there a question here for me?

William

On Sun, 25 Nov 2001 16:10:22 -0400, discuss-sudbury-model@sudval.org wrote:

> on 11/2/01 2:30 AM, Scott David Gray at sgray@aramis.sudval.org wrote:
>
> > Hi William,
> >
> > Could you clarify this post?
> >
> > On Thu, 1 Nov 2001, william van horn wrote:
> >
> >> . All I see it preparing
> >>> students for is a life of believing that democracy itself is a
shallow
> >> game
> >>> controlled by a few powerful people.
> >>>
> >>> Bruce Smith
> >>> Alpine Valley School
> >>
> >> Sorta like it usually works in the United States, right? How much do
you
> >> feel that your vote counts?
> >
> > It is very hard for me to understand the point that you
> > are making with this statement. I don't know whether you
> > are speaking sincerely or ironically, nor do I have any
> > sense to what extent you think most people feel their votes
> > "count."
> >
> > Of course, I'm presuming that your question is
> > rhetorical. Maybe it isn't? In which case my answer is:
> > "No less and no more than any other citizen's; my vote has
> > more weight at the town level than it does at the county
> > level, my vote has more weight at the county level than it
> > does at the state level, my vote has more weight at the
> > state level than it does nationally; and my voice usually
> > has more weight than my vote in any instance when I have
> > invested some energy to understand the issues and to discuss
> > my thoughts with other citizens."
> >
> > When I was in elementary Public school, I had a
> > "liberal" teacher who regularly asked people what they
> > wanted to do; who tried to "make learning fun."
> > In fact, I never felt _more_ powerless than when I was
> > asked what I wanted to do, and _knew_ in my heart that there
> > was a "wrong" answer. And I repeatedly _gave_ that wrong
> > answer (e.g. "I want to go home now" "I want you to give me
> > my comics back" "I want you to admit that you are a
> > slave-driving witch").
> > Giving the wrong answer was the only thing that kept me
> > sane. It prevented me from falling for the "we're partners
> > in your education" brainwashing that is the hallmark of
> > so-called progressive teachers, who try to "guide" children
> > into making the "right" choices.
> >
> > A choice is not a vote, unless some power of
> > enforcement (e.g. contract, money/property, police/troops,
> > broad public support in the wider community) is put at the
> > disposal of the body or its elected officials.
> > A choice made in a body that has no power of
> > enforcement, is a "poll" or "survey." Choosing an
> > "official" that in fact has no power (e.g. class president)
> > is not an election, but a popularity contest.
> >
> >> William M. Van Horn
> >> wmvh1@excite.com
> >> http://www.angelfire.com/art/inmystudio
> jjjkjkjkj
>
>
> ===========
>
> If you wish to be removed from this mailing list, please send an email TO
> majordomo@sudval.org (do NOT reply to the mailing list) with the
following
> phrase in the BODY (not the subject) of the message, replacing
> "email@host.dom" with the email address that you subscribed under:
>
> unsubscribe discuss-sudbury-model email@host.dom
>
> If you are interested in the subject, but the volume of mail sent is too
much,
> you may wish to consider unsubscribing from this list and subscribing to
> "dsm-digest"
>
> This mailing list is archived at http://www.sudval.org/~sdg/archives

William M. Van Horn
wmvh1@excite.com
http://www.angelfire.com/art/inmystudio

______________________________________________________________________________
Send a friend your Buddy Card and stay in contact always with Excite Messenger
http://messenger.excite.com

===========

If you wish to be removed from this mailing list, please send an email TO
majordomo@sudval.org (do NOT reply to the mailing list) with the following
phrase in the BODY (not the subject) of the message, replacing
"email@host.dom" with the email address that you subscribed under:

unsubscribe discuss-sudbury-model email@host.dom

If you are interested in the subject, but the volume of mail sent is too much,
you may wish to consider unsubscribing from this list and subscribing to
"dsm-digest"

This mailing list is archived at http://www.sudval.org/~sdg/archives



This archive was generated by hypermail 2.0.0 : Wed Mar 27 2002 - 19:39:48 EST